AI in Marketing & Manufacturing: Insights from Industry Expert Michelle Jones
Live with Alaska MEP
Join us for a live interview with Michelle Jones, founder of growwithcreativate.com!
Live Summary
Join Sami Jo Lewis and Megan Militello from the Alaska MEP as they interview Michelle Jones, the founder of Creativate.
Join us for an insightful live interview with Michelle, a seasoned expert in marketing, manufacturing, and construction materials. With a rich background working with both multi-million and multi-billion-dollar B2B companies, Michelle brings a wealth of knowledge and experience to the table. Her core beliefs center around the transformative power of creative thinking, data-driven decision-making, and continuous improvement. Michelle is passionate about helping small to medium-sized businesses thrive through effective marketing strategies tailored to their unique needs.
During the interview, she'll share valuable insights, lessons learned, and success stories from her career, offering practical advice and inspiration for businesses looking to elevate their marketing efforts.
Don't miss this opportunity to learn from Michelle's expertise live!
Key Highlights
Marketing and manufacturing in construction materials. 0:13
Marketing lessons learned from multimillion-dollar companies to small businesses. 3:28
Marketing strategies for small businesses. 9:01
Creative trade show booth ideas and personalized marketing strategies. 11:33
Marketing strategy and data-driven decisions. 17:37
Marketing strategies for small businesses. 22:28
AI technologies in manufacturing and marketing. 25:18
Using AI tools for marketing efficiency. 29:16
Transcription
Sami Jo Lewis 0:13
All right. Hi, everybody. Happy Thursday. Thank you so much for joining us at the Alaska. I know us here in Alaska. We're all happy to see some warmer temps and some sunshine and we've got a really great speaker setup for us today. And then I have my fabulous co host, Megan, who's also joining us How are you doing? Megan?
Megan Militello 0:33
I'm great. Thanks.
Michelle Jones 0:37
Well, thank you for being here. And then we have Michelle Jones and she is president of Creativate. And we're super excited to dive in and learn more about your business and how you help manufacturers and marketing. So to kind of get this ball rolling, get us kicked off. You tell us a little bit about your journey into marketing and manufacturing construction materials and like a little bit about your background and what really drew you into this field.
Well, ever since I was a little girl I dreamed of being an industrial marketing and construction Just kidding. Marketing, industrial materials and products just getting like most of us I believe I work with we do a lot of work in roofing. And a lot of people you get into this these types of industries two ways. You are either born into it or you get into it by accident. I got into it by accident. So my undergraduate degree is in marketing. The joke in my family is that I was sick as a kid and everyone knew I was better when I had scissors and glue crayons my hands I was colored against I've always had very much a creative brain but I also had the left side brain so I was a marketing major in accounting minor which is served really well in business to have both the right and left side dynamics going on. So I worked at a hospital straight out of college I actually moved to Washington DC and worked in government relations for a brief period of time. I lobbied for small and women owned businesses, including women construction owners and executives. Women in Public Policy we had we had some really amazing small business and micro business American Association for micro enterprise. So small businesses, my passion I was raised in small business. My parents were both small business owners growing up and then I got my MBA from Case Western Reserve University replied to a classified ad. Gosh, a decade no more than a decade ago. I'm getting old. And maybe the last one to get a job from a classified ad. But I got it. And it was growing industrial coated fabrics manufacturing like this is cool. I don't know what they do. But they do do this really cool thing called issuing you a paycheck and I'll take it on starting now. So I stumbled into the wonderful world of industrial credit fabrics. And one of those ended up being roofing one of the divisions was roofing they had do membranes, architectural fabrics, all kinds of stuff. And yeah, I got to I got gotten those industries and I've worked since for an industrial pump manufacturer, which was the second largest division of a multibillion dollar company publicly traded company. Were briefly for an architectural products manufacturer and then started my own company and we've primarily focused on either industrial, industrial manufacturing, commercial building products, or the services that support those two types of industries. And we are female owned and actually are an all female company at this point too. So yeah, amazing how many people are on our team? We have six now so for full time to part time and most of us are in the northeastern Ohio area, but we also have Chicago and Atlanta area. So yeah, we're growing and we're having fun doing it. So it's it's fun. I've jokingly called it a corporate recovery program because all of us have worked for big corporate companies. And so it's fun to just be like, in a small industry like small group, we get to see all the stuff that goes on all of our clients and all the times it's not who you think that has all the chaos and the drama. So yeah, we love what we do. And we're passionate about marketing. We're passionate about helping small businesses grow and I wake up everyday blessed that this is what I get to do. I love doing stuff like this, too. So this is a lot of fun. So I'm really excited to be here today. Wow.
Sami Jo Lewis 4:22
Yeah, thanks so much for sharing that background. And I love that you have kind of accidentally fell into this role and like look at it now. Like it's just like such access and female owned and that's amazing. And this wasn't a list of questions, but talk to us about your name. You have a really cool name and you talk right before we got online. So can you share what creative eight means?
Michelle Jones 4:42
Yeah, so Creativate is create plus cultivate plus innovate. So to me, it's kind of like the three stages of specifically marketing but business growth and development you like create the business you create the plan, you create the value proposition. You create whatever it is and then you cultivate your community then you are you in it, I'm sorry, create, cultivate innovate. you cultivate your community, you grow your business, you kind of get that flywheel going for inbound, and then you innovate from there. So whether it's products services, partnership with your clients are always kind of on this, this wheel of creating, cultivating and innovating. So I think if you remove any one of those pieces from business, it's going to be tough to really grow and thrive. So like good marketers do we love to mash work together. So that turned into creative eight, which also to me had a lot of like energy and it's bouncy and happy word like it just doesn't have the sound to it. So yeah, and then creative eight.com was already taken so it turned into growwithcreativate.com is the website so some Australian company took it.
Sami Jo Lewis 5:48
I like it. Well, thank you so much for sharing the background. So I remember I had to ask about it. Oh my god, it's so cool. So I felt like anyone out there listening, you know, kind of what got you started and, and whitening. So thank you. Yeah,
Megan Militello 5:59
that's the way throwing any random questions off of our on our list. Yeah, I love the value to that it has behind it. It's not just like this creative little oh, these words together like it really encompasses what you believe, which is great going into business. Yeah, yeah, saying you. I think you need to as business owners, especially in manufacturing, you have to be you can't be all things to all people. So I think it's important to pick words to associate with your company that are true to your value system. So anyways, I could get off the soapbox on that because I could jump on that all day long. But yeah,
Sami Jo Lewis 6:35
So yeah. Thank you for sharing that and diving in. So you have worked in the past with both multimillion multibillion dollar b2b companies. Can you talk to us about some key lessons you've learned? From those experiences that you believe would be valuable lessons for small businesses and manufacturers?
Michelle Jones 6:59
Well, I alluded to this earlier, but sometimes the people that have it together are the ones that you think and sometimes the people that are a hot mess aren't the ones that you think either. So what I've found through the years of working for everything from like a micro business all the way to a massive multibillion dollar company. A lot of times, people think big companies, big budgets, there's like all this money that they're throwing around. That is not always the case. Sometimes huge companies do not have the big budgets that you would think for marketing. So sometimes it's surprising, who's been super scrappy. And then sometimes you have small companies who, and I'm saying this, not necessarily on the employer side but or as an employee, but also what we see within clients, things like that to smaller companies understand the value of marketing and they invest almost as much if not more than some of these huge companies, but they see a higher return. So it's one of those things it's like what you put into it is what you get out of it. And the other thing that I see a lot of in terms of lessons is that Oh, should I lost my train of thought? No. Anyways, that's that was my biggest one that you see is it's not always who you think is that has it together does. And oh, the other thing too is marketing regardless of size or organization, especially in manufacturing tends to be undervalued, because a lot of times it is needed. But at the end of the day, it's all aged agents, human human. So all you are marketing, from a business to another business. Yes, you are trying to get a hold of a person at that company, whether it's procurement, sales, whatever, like you're trying to get a hold of someone else. So all of your marketing still needs to be, as I mentioned, true to your brand true to you to your to your products and services. And people can smell authenticity, regardless of the size of the company. So if something is not authentic, it's not going to resonate. So it's just it's surprising. Sometimes you think there's huge, huge company equals huge budget. Huge department all that. It's just not always the case. So it's also fun to see to how some of the differences between publicly traded companies versus family owned businesses or privately held businesses. I personally I love the like the legacy portion of family businesses and there's always the cultures they're always really special and really unique. So I always encourage companies that are like that to market that that's that's a huge advantage now especially with so much as being outsourced overseas and and now especially with all the supply chain issues over the last few years we're bringing looking at bringing so much more back to the States again. And I think that the companies that are still either made in the USA, family owned and operated room have huge, huge advantage in the coming months and years ahead. So I think that's really important to market and I think that being a small business actually can have quite a few more advantages than being a large business. With agility and all that so it's my little rabbit trail flash. So yeah, soapbox. Why mark? How marketing looks at different companies and some of the strengths and weaknesses I've just heard. It's just sad to me. I've heard too many family owned companies say well, we're too small. We can't do that. And I'm like, No, you're small. So you should be doing that. So it's about taking the narrative and spending it
Sami Jo Lewis 10:16
dispelling the different myths out there like just because like you think that you can't like you shed and it's really invaluable. And I also just love going back. I've never heard that. It's, you know, b2b or b2c, but it's h h like you're trying to talk to a human and I just thought that was super powerful.
Michelle Jones 10:32
Yeah. The other thing I see too is like, I think with small businesses and again in manufacturing, like it is aged age, and I see so many just dull, boring marketing efforts. And you got to be different. You got to be unique. You got to be memorable. I think a lot of times companies understand that marketing could be valuable and a person spent into it, but they're not usually not doing it well and you don't get that ROI that you'd like to see. So yeah, the memorable from human to human is extremely important.
Sami Jo Lewis 11:03
Going off and being memorable human the human. Do you have like any favorite marketing tactics that you've done for businesses that you're like, Man, this was such a fun one, just like a really cool example that you'd like to share.
Michelle Jones 11:15
I have one that I always share, and I apologize to anyone who's ever heard me before talking to you or to hear me talk about it again. This actually just came back from my voice a little we're actually I just came back from the International roofing Expo in Las Vegas, where I talked for like three days straight. So coming back, my voice is coming back. But especially at trade shows a lot of a lot of trade shows, especially manufacturing tend to be while we're there because we have to go and your absence is greater than your presence. Are we really getting value out of it and how do we get value out of it? And so a lot of companies just send the same booth every year. They kind of do whatever the usual is they played safe. But you know, you're spending a lot of money between your booth costs, your freight dredge, labor setup, all that stuff, your hotel costs flights and your people cost time, all of it. And I believe that if you're going to bother going make something memorable and different. So one year product line, I was working on had there. Believe it was like our 35th anniversary or something like that. I've been in business. And the product line was founded in 1979. When we looked at our target audience and our target personas, a lot of those individuals were males in their 50s and 60s. And so we said what resonates with these guys, I'm gonna say guys so much guys. And everything in 1979 is like very nostalgic for them and they loved it. So we did a whole 1979 themed booth. We gave away record players. We only had top hits from 1979 plane. I redid the whole booth and retro. Like I had an orange shag rug in the middle of the booth. I had vinyl on the walls. I got the the brown and orange wallpaper. It looks like we're on that 70 show we got I actually went thrift shopping and got a bunch of like end tables and some furniture that was easy to find. From the seven weeks that we set up in the booth. We had a blast and people would literally just come and hang out in the booth and we're like, oh my god. This is amazing. And they wanted to be there because it was so fun and different. Right? While all of our competitors were over there doing their usual you know, white walls and pretty graphics and that type of thing. We said let's double down and go all in and it was so much fun and so memorable and we had a blast with it like we did. We end up spinning it off into a whole like retro campaign where we made all of our ads for a few months look like they were from 1979 and we did like a little retro logo and we did all kinds of stuff and it was just like a blast from the past but it was so much fun. So I still remember that people still remember it if you mentioned it to this day. That was probably back in awhile. I guess I could do the math, but I won't try to do that live. So yeah, that was my favorite one. So it's like daring to do something just a little bit different and memorable. And if you're your own target audience that makes it really easy. Like what would I want to see? I wouldn't be part of or if you don't know ask ask your target bounce ideas off your target audience and your people and see what which one's cool to Yeah, so
Sami Jo Lewis 14:29
cool. I can I imagine I mean you guys just had so much fun getting that all set up as you're talking about did you feel like you saw like a lot more traffic? I mean, you were like, okay, they're gonna like main content. Like you said like your booth always seemed busy compared to like the regular so you sent out the box and it definitely like paid off like you benefited from that taking that chance and taking that risk.
Michelle Jones 14:48
It sounded like yeah, the only downer some people that you don't want to linger in your booth are going to linger and you're like get out. Someone else wants to sit in the wooden tweet color chair covered Chair Okay. I would say that was the only downer but yeah, it was fun and record players are you know, they were 5070 bucks. Like they weren't huge for giveaways and we can mail it back to people and then they go home and have a record player waiting for him. You know, it was fun. It was different. Just different, right? Yeah. Then it you have to make an impact on people because look at everything we have now. You know, like, yeah, I want to be we are very thoughtful with our energy and our time now. Right? So it's like where am I going to put that in when you're walking through those halls of the shows? I mean, it's so easy to just kind of skim by places because it's just a beginner. Not much going on. So I love that what a great what a great move. Remove Yeah, I love doing like, I mean, it's still safe, but it's just a little offer different. I did a mailer one time where we put everything in a shiny envelope like a shiny padded blue shiny envelope. And if you get a manila envelope, you're probably throw it out. I tell you what, if you get a shiny tesni on this the next time you get a shiny venular Tell me that's not the first thing you're going to open
Sami Jo Lewis 16:13
I love getting mail I love mailers. Like I think of like five like I want to do more mailers to really get me I get excited like if I get like someone sending me piano shape but like you're right like if it's a white envelope like I'm like, Bill, are you been a bit shiny? I mean, I'm going to be interested so we all have
Michelle Jones 16:40
shiny object syndrome is what I call it like we and so I make it like a literal shiny object. But I mean to that point, like like you said Megan everything is digital now and we have it all so I know we do a lot of digital marketing and inbound marketing but man I'm a sucker for a good journal like not journals to people. I love like sending physical things in the mail and, and people still we still love that and we don't get it anymore. Handwritten notes go a long way I'm giving you all my secrets now, but I mean, sometimes I just like it doesn't have to be that radical either. Just has to be really intentional. And really, yeah. How do you make it more personal, you know, like, I want to build this relationship with you because what is human to human? Right? Yeah, yeah. So so there's there's three ideas I guess the go retro are a little bit different. Find a shiny object and make it really personal and sometimes
Sami Jo Lewis 17:29
risk taking all your secrets. So thank you so much for sharing your live exactly.
Michelle Jones 17:35
Go forth and prosper. It'll be great.
Sami Jo Lewis 17:42
So, learn learning a little bit about your business and through your core beliefs. I saw they emphasize the importance of creativity. You talked about data driven decisions and continuous improvement. How has these beliefs shaped your approach to marketing strategy? Over the years?
Michelle Jones 18:00
The I think the biggest thing with is continuous improvement. So I hear this all the time. Well tell me what's going to work, what's going to work. Whatever works for this person might not work for this person. And so you have to continuously be evolving and looking at quite frankly, everything you do all the time. So what worked two years ago may not work now. I'm so sick of talking about the pandemic, but look at what happened during the pandemic. I mean, if we look at our marketing strategies in February of 2020, those shifts fast like on a dime into April, I had to drop all of our paid campaigns because it would seem insensitive to be pushing our products when people were dying. There was a fortunately we we were invisible businesses and industrial manufacture. And so we shifted our target we like basically ditched our whole marketing plan for the year and shifted into we're not promoting our products were more just kind of letting people know how we're supporting the pandemic. So one of our customers was Purell. So we talked a lot about how our pumps and their parts were going into the making of hand sanitizer. So that and then we featured a winery that bought a bunch of our pumps because they changed from making wine and to making standardization products. So it turned really, it turned so fast. And we saw during the pandemic that the people that were able to pick quickly, were the ones that thrived. So that's why like any of our clients, we don't actually in our team, we're not really a big fan of just the rinse and repeat stuff we like to try new things. We like to experiment with stuff. We're always looking at how we can constantly improve and grow. And that's true with manufacturing, too. I mean, you look at Kaizen boards and all that out there on the plant floor and you've got all types of all types of continuous improvement opportunities. So that's where I think it's really fun where normally you think marketing and water could be like, what marketing and manufacturing can be like oil and water and they don't mix. They absolutely do have a lot of a lot of similarities. And what were the other two items you said it caught the continuous improvement one.
Sami Jo Lewis 19:59
Yeah, no. Creativity and data driven decisions.
Michelle Jones 20:06
And I think we talked a little bit about creativity with the last one. data driven decisions. We're at such a cool point in marketing right now, where before we only had a billboard you had a magazine ad and unless someone called you up and said hey, I saw you on a billboard which is not going to happen very often in industrial manufacturing. You don't you don't really know where your marketing dollars were going. You kind of put it out there on a hope and a prayer and hope that it worked. What's the old phrase I don't have my marketing is working. I just don't know which half that's I mean, that's not as true anymore as it used to be. So now especially with digital marketing, so I'm a HubSpot partner because I love being able to connect all the dots. You can do that really well on the HubSpot platform where you can say hey, here's my my ads that I'm putting out. Here's my social media posts. Here's the emails and you can connect all the dots and follow the entire customer journey start to finish that data is not only critical for marketing so you're not spending money in Washington wasting it but it's also critical for sales to know accounting loves that kind of stuff because then you can say Good. economy goes downturn, they come to marketing first. We're gonna cut you and we're like well, that's a bad idea because that 100,000 You're spending on marketing is generating $2.1 million business. What's Yeah, we're not cutting that. I didn't think so. So that's what really helps determine and make more informed decisions that can really help you grow. It's still not perfect, obviously and probably never will be able to ever completely capture what's been done in marketing and how it helps you grow but it's definitely way lightyears ahead and I love data driven decisions that's my accountant left brain side coming out. The I love when when you when you can I love being able to track all those data points together. To tell the whole story of your customer
Sami Jo Lewis 21:58
and it's so true there's so much out there that nowadays where you can really really track the ROI and like see like what is working and hopefully that you know no not what not take away and what they kind of double down on talking about
Michelle Jones 22:11
Yeah, yeah, cuz you don't want to take away the wrong thing. And as marketers, especially if you're a full time marketer, that's job security to to be able to say, Hey, your look what I'm doing is resonating. I'll tell you what, there's not a single C suite in this country that's not going to want someone to come to them and say hey, look at some dashboards for you. I have some reports. For you, that show you how you're spared the return you're getting on your spend. I mean, you want to light up someone's face to become their new favorite go do that as marketer. I mean, they'll fall over backwards. So yeah.
Sami Jo Lewis 22:43
It sounds like you're a HubSpot partner but you have so a lot of our manufacturers or viewers are really really small. And they're really just like diving into marketing, you know, they're hitting on some social, you have a platform that you would recommend or just like easy tracking, like you know, the top two or three things that maybe they should be tracking to see if their marketing is coming success.
Megan Militello 23:08
A good question.
Michelle Jones 23:12
All right, yeah. Well, that's okay. Don't throw all the curveballs for fun. I mean, we use a lot of HubSpot. It is more of an investment but you also some ways you get what you paid for. I mean, when I started out, I even got into it very quickly, as a solopreneur myself just because I'm able to track everything. I think the biggest thing is find your why behind anything you're doing. Why am I posting on social media? Why am I posting on that platform? Who am I going after? Where do they hang out? I think there's so much. We do a lot of paid advertising. Yes. And that's kind of like the quick hit the quick fix, but focusing on thought leadership is so much more valuable than going out and just buying an ad. So if you're if you're a solopreneur and you're just starting up with Thought Leadership, the best thing you can possibly do to market yourself. So I know that public speaking is the number one killer in America but go talk to your local Rotary or go talk to whoever wherever people are hanging out. That may possibly be interested in what you have to say and it's not a product pitch. You never make a product pitch right away. You just talk about lessons you've learned the value you have to offer. I love lists I love like top five lists or top 10 things that you should know or checklists or even do checklists, things to look for when you're looking for someone who's searching for your product or service. So you know, checklist of 20 things you need to ask before hiring a marketing company isn't something I could use. So I think knowing your why. And then my other suggestion in terms of marketing is to lean into your network, your network, hate the phrase your network, your net worth, I think Gen Z has just destroyed that. But there is a lot of value to it. Like I've grown my company to the point it's gotten to so quickly, mainly through networking, and through referrals. So I know that's not like, here's your plan. You're going to do three posts a week and you're going to do one email blast. I mean, you just you don't know and everyone's company is different. The people you're marketing to a little different. So you just get started and kind of through the process of trial and error. You find out what works for you. We were doing a monthly newsletter for our company, and it came it just got to be a lot to put together really quality information every month. So rather than just putting something together for the sake of putting it together, we now do it every other month. Just because it didn't seem to affect our recipients engagement at all, and it's one less email people's inboxes but then when they do get it they know there's going to be some good info in there. We get a little bit cheesy brainers to like we make fun dad jokes and stuff like that and our newsletters have to be boring. Again, back to be memorable, just be memorable. But we are cheesy corny, and we do make dad jokes so that works for us.
Sami Jo Lewis 26:01
So we need another dad joke. We need to learn the dad jokes. We just need to join your newsletter.
Love that. We'll make sure to put that link. Anyone that's listening that wants to join and hear all about the new dad jokes and some different party tricks. We'll make sure to link that in the bio so no thank you so know your Wi Fi network. I think those are really great big viewers and manufacturers can take away from this finding I wanted to talk about AI technologies. I know that your partner with Jasper AI and I wanted to just kind of hear how they are revolutionising the manufacturing industry and assisting businesses in streamlining their operations and enhancing marketing efforts and how you really utilize AI technologies.
Michelle Jones 26:59
Do you remember I think it was around like 2008 or something like that. Everyone said papers dead. We're not using paper anymore. Paper is dead. That was we'll go back even further the internet, you know, Oh, it's scary. It's going to take down the world. I mean, it seems like every 10 years or something that comes through that's kind of disruptive and everyone starts talking and AI is definitely that platform or that technology of this decade for sure. The difference is that AI is going to stick so like it or not. AI is sticking around I just saw commercial last night even for Expedia is partnered with chat GBT to go through to allow you to say hey, I want to sit with a nice view on the beach with my pet and wheelchair accessible or something like that, like recommended hotels that were then a four hour driving distance. I'm like right. So I think it's just like anything else. And there's different types of AI just sat there really, actually awesome speech by David Koch, who's a CBS correspondent on Sunday morning, talking about all the different types of AI and its evolution and how we got to where we are but basically we are really really close to add at the processing speed of what we can come up with. I know you've seen there's always some mistakes AI is not good with like hands and fingers and bodies and things like that. It messes that up people have like eight fingers on one hand coming out of their years something weird, but we're really close to it being actually really helpful and really useful. Like I the other day just looked on the Microsoft version of what a roof tear off looks like. And it had like these big velociraptors like flying around a roof and like 18 guys in a little tiny space like all the shovels are beyond the roof and I'm like, close but not quite like it's there. So, basically, so you have these like big concept things we hear about deep fakes. We hear about all of that now, and yes, that part's dark and scary. It's like the internet. There's dark and scary parts out there. There's also a lot of good that comes from it. So in the case of manufacturers, especially solopreneurs AI can be an extremely useful to pull in terms of productivity. So I'll give a couple examples. We started using Read AI because it's like 20 bucks a month. It not only gives out the plug for read AI completely paid for it not only will give you a summary of your meeting and record the video, but it will also give you who said what, who committed to do what and next steps and then before the meeting the following week, three three meeting for me. It will send me a reminder of everything that we discussed who's doing what next and it will send all your participants that as well. So right like talking about a time saver, you know. So you mentioned Jasper, so we became Jasper partners, it's much more much more robust platform they're growing like crazy. It's kind of similar to HubSpot. So if you're not familiar with HubSpot, HubSpot has not it's like a CRM and they have these hubs that are all connected to it. So your HubSpot is your portal and you can go in and you customize it. Jasper is kind of set up the same way. So you have a portal you go in and the more you use it, the more it learns from you and it becomes specific to you so like chat GPT I know people love it, but every time you go in there you're starting from scratch, and you're using outdated data. Jasper from like, what is it 2020 2120 I can't remember what the cutoff point is for Jasper right now for a chat GPT to Jasper, you can go in and you can upload your brand voice. You can upload your tone. It will learn how you talk and how you speak based on previous inputs. So it can be really handy. It doesn't do all the work for you, but it can definitely shorten your time and be more efficient. So for example, if I have a blog post outlined, and I go through and I type in like here are the 10 things I want to highlight or talk about, I want it to be a professional tone going to other business people whatever it will go through and it will write it for me and then I go back and I make some medicine some changes. It's still my thoughts like it's still my my opinions, my viewpoint it was still my list. You can ask it to read the list if you wanted to. But it's still my list. And it just saved me a ton of time from having to go through do what I was already going to do. And in terms of like learning models with amazing is we talked about data earlier. So in the future and even now AI is being used to read different data points and put together a story or a summary for you whereas before you would have had to go through matching all of yourself. So you could say here's my you know my output and manufacturing. Here's the top line sales, here's what marketing is doing. It can help combine it all for you and give you the analytics and the output that you need. So it's just like any other tool like you use it the right way. It can be really powerful. It can be really good. So we're really excited. About Jasper, they only started I forget, four or five years ago. They added like 60 More people last year we're gonna add a ton I mean they are growing crazy. So we know there's a huge need for it. But especially as a solopreneur there's a lot of tools like that that you can use to maximize and make your time really efficient. Canva is also building more AI tools. I know a lot of solopreneurs use Canva shoot, we use Canva like we've met it before it used to be everything you talk about you're like, I don't use Canva now or marketer, but now they did another round of funding last year and they're their tools keep getting better and better and you can do really cool things now like come up so you can use like Jasper to come up with your list of what you want your social media posts to be and you have your brand standards, your guide and everything in there and then you can put it all into Canva and it will auto generate 10 posts with these types of images. Here's all my text and it'll auto generate all that for you. So if you look at it, steal your thoughts steal your directory. It's just efficiency. Who doesn't want to especially in the manufacturing